Jack 11 years ago on Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
Yes life is too short for negativity Dr Lawrence which is why it's so sad we the people of the Bahamas have been put in this situation by the local vets. So dry your tears because we wish you could walk in our shoes as volunteers that go into the community in OUR OWN TIME and see the pain and suffering as you do. It's not just about the spays and neuters, it's about the community spirit that Operation Potcake has created. It's about the massive educational drive that will make the next generation of Bahamians more caring people. It's about going into yards across the island en mass and working out ways to help the animals together with the owners. Operation Potcake brings the people together from all walks of life and and gives them all a warm fuzzy feeling about caring for animals. It's about Bahamians and foreigners standing together and working out a solution because many hands make light work. Why would the vets possibly want to stop this wonderful momentum that has been created?? You tell me if you care about animals so much? I know the answer and it's greed and short sightedness
blackcat 11 years ago on Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
@ ThisisOurs, I completely agree. I have dealt with Dr. Bizzell before, as well as his associates at his practice, along with other vets on the island with never a doubt of their skills or professionalism. I have never had the experience of seeing Dr. Johnson but have heard excellent things about her too, from more than one person who were very pleased with the care she extended to their animals. I don't want to speak for anyone else, but I don't believe the concern here has anything to do with questioning the vets' skills.
The issue here is that the problem is out of control. High volume spay and neuter campaigns at low cost have been proven to work and aid significantly in putting a cap on the problem. Many animal rights groups such as Pink Potcake, Baark etc work hard all year round to spay and neuter stray dogs/ cats on their own time. This cannot be done without the help of local vets and for that, us volunteers are hugely grateful. But doing little by little throughout the year is simply a band-aid approach as many of us have full time jobs and time is limited.
Operation Potcake has happened once before and amazing and successful results were seen. It is not like the vets did not know what they were getting into this time around, having participated last year. If they had any doubts, they should have been communicated up front and early on before out -of-town volunteers had already gone out of their way to arrange travel and accomadation plans. It is simply bad form for the vets to handle the situation as they did. A commitment like this is a large one and no doubt the volunteers and op potcake organizers appreciate the time and effort vets put into such an event-- but confirmation should never have been given only to back out at the last moment. They knew this event was a charitable one from the get go and profits were not expected to be made. If they didn't think they could afford to participate, they should have given notice right away.
Furthermore, the logic behind the decision is simply beyond me. If your #1 concern is for the animals who suffer daily with no voice, then why not accept the help being offered from the foreign vets and assistants? I am sure the bahamian vets would be looked on with great admiration for opening their arms to guests who are willing to help us with this massive problem.
dogfriendly 11 years ago on Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
To the vets: can you put aside your differences with the OP program and let them just get on with their good work? In any case, the dogs and cats in the OP realm will never enter your doors because most are wild, stray, or in yards of the inner city. For sure, your personnel will never go out an take the time to trap them, and for sure no payment of $50 will cross the table! OP did such a wonderful job last year in spite of difficult situations (including a robbery) and they will have another successful 2014 if you will cease this posturing and let them get on with their work.
TruthSayer 11 years ago on Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
Thank you for that very accurate breakdown of costs. It is obvious the BVMA numbers are padded.
I have read their letter and it is very clear that they do not want foreign vets coming in to work for free. They are trying to backtrack now, because frankly, they are getting destroyed in the media. If in fact, the intent of their letter was to open a dialog about the option for another plan, they might want to rethink who they have write their formal letters. Because from the looks of the comments in this blog (many of which post direct quotes from the letter) everyone seems to have the same interpretation of the meaning.
First they agree to work with the groups that comprise Operation Potcake. Then they see how much money was raised and how much money the volunteers spent getting to the Bahamas and they think (Ka-ching!) we can get all that money and we can say we will do the job and make some money as well! Didn't anticipate the pushback on you plan, did you? Why is everyone acting this way towards you? Because they do not like being lied to, they do not like promises being broken, they do not like people who can't give 10-14 days out of their year to volunteer to help those less fortunate. I'm not as all saying that none of the vet association doesn't volunteer, but the letter from your leader certainly does not reflect that.
So let's say you do 500 surgeries for $50, we now know the actual cost of the supplies is roughly $17, but I'll round up in your favor to $20. They pay you $50 x 500 = $25,000. Actual costs are $10,000. That gives your a nice profit of $15,000. Here is the problem with your thinking, you assumed people were dumb, but they aren't, no even close. Animal Welfare volunteers are some of the smartest people I have ever met and some of the most passionate. That is a bad mixture if you try to BS them and then do something that is not in the best interest of the animals. One can see from this blog, that you have found that out.
In your letter, you also mention you can only do 3 days, just too much of a hardship for you to do more. That doesn't bode well with people either, not people who spend their vacation time going to volunteer to help animals, not the people who plan their days off a year in advance to be be able to volunteer more. So, you grudging offer to work for 3 days and make a profit, even if it is not your normal profit margin, that pisses them off.
In the end whatever is decided about the money, you cannot make the impact required to address the overpopulation in 3 days with just a few vets. Battles are not won by a few soldiers taking out a few other soldiers. It takes an army. You were offered a well trained, dedicated army to help you fix your problem. They deal with the dogs that would never, ever grace the doors of your clinics.
I hope everybody can swallow their pride, lick their wounds and honor the commitments they made.
browndogtci 11 years ago on Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
If you don't make any money from it Dr. Bizzell then was does it matter who does it?? Having just participated in a spay/neuter clinic in Turks & Caicos I saw first hand what it takes to spay/neuter that many animals in such a short time period. It was like a military operation. Without the experience and know how of Pets Without Vets (vets and vet assistants!) who been there, done that it would not have been possible. Just because you're a vet does not make you qualified to manage such a large scale clinic. Shame on you and your fellow vets in the Bahamas!!
TruthSayer 11 years ago on Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
BVMA,
Do you have a problem with people getting their food from a food bank? Do you have a problem with the parents of a sick child getting free medical care? Would it matter if the people suppling the food to the food back were from the U.S or some other country? Would it matter where the Dr. came from that was treating the child? I know the Nassau has the "good" hospital and the "other" hospital. If you can pay, you go to the "good" one, if you can't you go to the "other" one. I have yet to see one of your grocery stores saying that the food bank has to pay them to get food to feed the needy. But I am guessing that if they did a story on the grocery stores requiring all the food banks purchase their food from them at a profit, they would have the same feedback you are getting. You are not unique, you just made a bad choice and now you reap what you sow……..you keep trying to put a good spin on what you have done and frankly, the hole you are digging keeps getting deeper.
watcher 11 years ago on Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
Dr Bizzel - do us all a favour and stop running after each and every post here trying to justify the despicable actions taken by local vets.
I, and hope many, many, others will be using my Twitter and Facebook accounts to publicise the greed of you and your kind, and I hope that the "outside world" sees you all for what you really are - greedy, uncaring and self-absorbed.
'Listen to vets and stray dog problem will never be solved'
INTERNATIONAL organisation Animal Balance has warned that the country’s stray animal problem will never be resolved if the government listens to local veterinarians.
TruthSayer 11 years ago on 'Listen to vets and stray dog problem will never be solved'
'Listen to vets and stray dog problem will never be solved'
That is a fact! I know I will never vacation there and I will advise anyone and everyone I know to not vacation there as well.
But I would come back to help the animals, in a heart beat. For us, helping those that can't help themselves and making the world a better place has more value than sitting on the beach getting a tan or losing money in a Casino. That's what I don't think they understand, we do this to make the world better, we don't care about taking anyones job, head butting with their egos or gaining any kudos. Aggressive high volume spay/neuter, along with education and outreach works. A few vets working 3 days to only do 150 surgeries at a cost that is prohibitive, is not going to cut it. 150 surgeries at $50 per surgery = $7500 or 150 surgeries at the actual cost of supplies, which is $17 (but I'll round up to $20) = $3000
Bottom line is, 150 surgeries is not going to have the effect that is required, 1000 would. The local vets can't handle that, they said so themselves. So drop the egos, drop the money grubbing and get on with it and fix the problem! They would be heroes if they just let this project go forward (which they agreed to do last year), because they would have implemented a multifaceted program that was effective and humane. The world has been watching this and they just need to lick some wounds and get back to what they agreed to. Do the right thing, is that so hard?
TruthSayer 11 years ago on 'Listen to vets and stray dog problem will never be solved'
'Listen to vets and stray dog problem will never be solved'
Tory,
You don't have to walk the Ghetto at night to see the packs of dogs. They are all over downtown and the Fish Market area. Yes, packs of them. If they were smart they would stay out of the Ghetto areas unless they want to be robbed at gunpoint, like the volunteers were last year.
Why do say Emma Clifford needs to fck off and mind her won business? My guess from reading some of your posts on the other stories, is that you are either one of the Vets or possibly a family member.
Should everyone who came to the Bahamas to help with the stray dog population just fck off and mind their own business? If so, how do you plan to fix the problem on our own? Petty, childish like yours, simply show your lack of understanding for the situation at best, at worst, they show your mentality. Stomping your feet and having a temper tantrum is not going to do anything fix the issue.
So I ask again, what are YOU doing?
banker 11 years ago on 'Listen to vets and stray dog problem will never be solved'
'Listen to vets and stray dog problem will never be solved'
The lot of you are making Bahamians look stupid in international eyes. In case you hadn't noticed, we have 20% and greater endemic unemployment. The average person on Facebook has 250 friends with a social outreach of 125,000 people. You guys don't understand the power of losing just 1 vacationer because of idiocy. That one vacationer has a 50-50 chance of affecting the vacation decision of up to 125,000 people. Talk about fiddling while Rome burned.
Bahamians are too lazy to clean up the stray dog mess, and when the gift of help arrives, we look the gift horse in the mouth. Suk teeth. This nation will never be enlightened. You all should be ashamed of yourselves. The author of the letter has a valid point, and y'all laugh while your bread and butter slips away.
henny 11 years ago on 'Listen to vets and stray dog problem will never be solved'
'Listen to vets and stray dog problem will never be solved'
I wholeheartedly agree with Banker 100%
BiminiHomeowner 11 years ago on It's about animals, not vets
It's about animals, not vets
Supporting the mission of Operation Potcake goes beyond the concerns of "animal lovers." This is a quality of life issue for all residents of the Bahamas.
Having such a serious problem with strays makes the Bahamas look bad as a country, turning away tourists and investors. These stray, uncared for animals also often become nuisances or dangers to residents and visitors.
This problem also contributes to many Bahamians viewing dogs and cats as "pests" that should just be killed or exterminated. This perception that some locals have also makes the Bahamas look "backwards" to many people who would are looking to invest here.
The VMAB's decision has only made these problems worse. Worse for the animals, worse for the people that live here, and worse for their reputations as care-providers for these animals.
It's a shame.
shantelle 11 years ago on It's about animals, not vets
It's about animals, not vets
Id like the know who will pay for the vets 'intended' plan to spay/neuter 3,000 per year. They are certainly not going to finance these surgeries themselves.
Currently it is dedicated volunteers of the local animal organizations that work tirelessly to raise these funds for spay/neuters along with generous donors that believe in the cause.
The most effective use of this hard earned money is to perform as many spay/neuters for the least cost possible which is what will happen at Operation Potcake where they provide the materials, buy in bulk at minimal cost and vets donate their time.
Allow the foreign vets in, let them do another 1,000 spay/neuters and believe me there will still be enough dogs and cats left if local vets still want to carry our their proposed plan as well.
When you have starving and suffering animals on the streets there should be no time for pride, egos and a need for power or control. Arguing politics is taking valuable time away from helping the animals, the volunteers certainly would rather be spending their time being proactive - why don't the vets?
TERRI 11 years ago on It's about animals, not vets
It's about animals, not vets
It seems pretty simple to me, the foreign volunteers would be here for 5 days under Operation Potcake. Last time I checked that would leave 360 days for local vets to continue on with the spay/neuter programme and gain the respect they are looking for.
ETJ 11 years ago on Operation Potcake has been cancelled following opposition from local vets. How do you think the spay and neuter programme should be run?
Operation Potcake has been cancelled following opposition from local vets. How do you think the spay and neuter programme should be run?
Pro bono means FREE, not $50 per. Wonderful that you did over 7000 surgeries ($350,000!) but...then why is there still such a problem? Obviously because that was not nearly enough. And again what is the plan by the VMAB to actually solve this problem instead of continuing to do a trickle to be paid for by struggling humane societies and rescues, and to stop efforts that might actually have a meaningful impact in a shorter period of time?
What do you mean by ineffective canine control programs? If you are implying that more animals need to be killed you are so woefully behind the times it's not even funny. Please do your homework on EFFECTIVE and HUMANE solutions to pet over population problems. If you are advocating catching and killing more animals, that does not speak well of you as a veterinary professional. Not in 2013. It has not been recognized as an effective method of animal control, for many many years now.
Local vets have agreed to this providing their expenses are paid??? Why should animal welfare orgs be held hostage like this if there are people willing to come in here and do more in a shorter time frame than local vets are able to do? There is no shame in that, but there is shame in local vets stopping such efforts without a comparable effort being made and maybe just maybe a little TRUE pro bono, i.e. FREE, work being donated. You are not helping the reputation and public opinion of local vets with posts such as this. People are disgusted and frustrated and your reasoning is irrational and defensive. Not one iota of concern for the helpless animals. THIS is the problem, and the disconnect that the VMAB caused with that highly offensive letter, absolutely needs to be rectified if they hope to salvage any public support at all. You cannot beat reasonable, ordinary, caring people over the head and expect them to capitulate to unreasonable and ineffective demands. Being negative and defensive only makes you look worse. If indeed the VMAB is committed to dealing with this problem, then surely face to face meetings would have been preferable to that awful negative letter; and waiting til almost the 11th hour before Operation Potcake was to commence has not helped.
Jack 11 years ago on Operation Potcake has been cancelled following opposition from local vets. How do you think the spay and neuter programme should be run?
Operation Potcake has been cancelled following opposition from local vets. How do you think the spay and neuter programme should be run?
Bizzell. If you're not making any money they why are you trying to stop others from coming in?? If you were so sure that you're just breaking even then it would make much more sense for you to just let the other vets come and do the full 5 days while you guys get on with your precious practices.
You've never supported this project, you sure as hell don't care about animals, only turning a profit. Bahamian vets doing something for free, don't make me laugh.
HarryWyckoff 11 years ago on Operation Potcake has been cancelled following opposition from local vets. How do you think the spay and neuter programme should be run?
Operation Potcake has been cancelled following opposition from local vets. How do you think the spay and neuter programme should be run?
Really, how backwards is the VMAB being here.
They've had years to step up and help with the nation's Potcake problem, and have failed miserably.
Now they are refusing to allow vets VOLUNTEERING from overseas to enter the country to help deal with the problem.
And why? Because somehow, they think these stray potcakes should all be paying $50 each.
I guess the VMAB isn't quite smart enough to realise that STRAY dogs don't have owners. Or bank accounts. or $50 in cash between their paws.
Protectionist fools who put profit before betterment of the country.
They are a disgrace.
KimAra 11 years ago on Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
Operation Potcake cancelled after local vet opposition
This is not intended to become a “he said, she said” battle, however we feel that the organizers of Operation Potcake MUST respond to a couple of remarks made over the last 24 hours.
We did indeed try and meet with the VMAB just last week, and were refused to be part of the meeting. One of our organizers recently invited the President of the VMAB to lunch .
To say that the letter from the VMAB was an invitation to “merely voice their concerns” is misleading when language such as:
“We politely decline the offer to have the additional veterinarians come in to assist in surgeries, inclusive of the cat clinic at the BHS.” “We still feel that to send a clear message to our fellow Bahamians, that we are an entity more than capable of managing the difficult task of reducing our strays, and it should be none but our own that assume that responsibility.” “With that said each veterinarian would like remuneration in the amount of $50 per animal after services are rendered, which we all agree is a nominal fee for our efforts” is used. It did not appear to us to be an invitation for dialogue but a “fait accompli” ; we had the option to take it or leave it.
4.In a breakdown of supplies needed for this years OP, factoring in $9,000.00 to the local vets, excluding the vaccines Plus the following supplies:
ANESTHETICS: Ketamine: $1,038.00
Xylazine:10 bottles...... $500.00
Valium: 100 $11.45 = $1,145
Isoflurane (Gas Anesthesia) 6 x 35 = $210.00
Grand anesthetics approx. $ 2,893.00 Suture material & cold sterilization, gauze $5,000.00 300 Local Vet Surgeries - $ 9,000.00 Vaccines - $ 2,469.00 Anesthetics (visiting vets) - $ 2,893.00
Grand Total - $19,362.00 10% discount = $17,394.00
Just over $19.00 per animal. (includes budgeting local vets $30 a dog)
Minus $9,000 (local vets) total: $17.75 per animal.
The quantities and product list supplied by very qualified, well respected Veterinarian, some months ago Numbers based on Local Vets 300 animals visiting vets 600 animals.
I invite everybody to tell me how the cost per animal is now $50.00, what costs and products is this based upon?
Dialogue is needed, based on facts, not finger pointing and insulting I have endevoured to put down r what I believe to be facts and facts alone…